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  #71  
Old 06-08-2012, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
I think that Obama did the best that he could with the situation that he was given and the obstacles thrown in his path. He has my vote.
If the best he could do was oversee 4 years of $1 Trillion plus deficits and over $16 Trillion deficit in total at the end of 4 years (when he promised to cut said deficit in half), have less Americans holding jobs today than when he took office, produce 3 budgets that have garnered exactly ZERO votes in either house, oversee the first US sovereign debt downgrade in American history, have the lowest home ownership rate since the mid-60s, add nearly 20 million people onto the food stamp program, have the percentage of taxpayers be the lowest % on record, and have his signature piece of legislation about to be ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court . . . I have to ask, WHY DOES HE STILL HAVE YOUR VOTE??
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Last edited by Wizard24; 06-11-2012 at 12:57 PM.
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  #72  
Old 06-11-2012, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizard24 View Post
If the best he could do was oversee 4 years of $1 Trillion plus deficits and over $16 Trillion deficit in total at the end of 4 years (when he promised to cut said deficit in half), have less Americans holding jobs today than when he took office, produce 3 budgets that have garnered exactly ZERO votes in either house, oversee the first US sovereign debt downgrade in American history, have the lowest home ownership rate since the mid-60s, add nearly 20 million people onto the food stamp program, have the percentage of taxpayers be the lowest % on record, and have his signature piece of legislation about to be ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court . . . I have to ask, WHY DOES HE STILL HAVE YOUR VOTE??
Because, McCain, Romney nor any other Republican care about any of the issues that you mention. They care more about lower tax rates on the wealthy than addressing any issues that our nation face. His real problem was that Obama trying to work with the Republican congress and all they were interested in was to keep him from being re-elected. Go ahead and keep voting for the Republicans, the self-named Conservatives. But, be ready for more movement of individuals from the middle-class to the lower-class. Hillary and Bill tried to convince everyone that health-care needed addressed in the early to mid-90s but it didn't become an issue until "your" health-care goes away or costs to much.

"If they would rather die,'' said Scrooge, "they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population."

I desire that the next generation has it better than the current. It doesn't look promising with the current so-called, self-named conservative, christian majority.
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  #73  
Old 06-11-2012, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizard24 View Post
If the best he could do was oversee 4 years of $1 Trillion plus deficits and over $16 Trillion deficit in total at the end of 4 years (when he promised to cut said deficit in half), have less Americans holding jobs today than when he took office, produce 3 budgets that have garnered exactly ZERO votes in either house, oversee the first US sovereign debt downgrade in American history, have the lowest home ownership rate since the mid-60s, add nearly 20 million people onto the food stamp program, have the percentage of taxpayers be the lowest % on record, and have his signature piece of legislation about to be ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court . . . I have to ask, WHY DOES HE STILL HAVE YOUR VOTE??
Because, McCain, Romney nor any other Republican care about any of the issues that you mention. They care more about lower tax rates on the wealthy than addressing any issues that our nation face. His real problem was that Obama trying to work with the Republican congress and all they were interested in was to keep him from being re-elected. Go ahead and keep voting for the Republicans, the self-named Conservatives. But, be ready for more movement of individuals from the middle-class to the lower-class. Hillary and Bill tried to convince everyone that health-care needed addressed in the early to mid-90s but it didn't become an issue until "your" health-care goes away or costs to much.

"If they would rather die,'' said Scrooge, "they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population."

I desire that the next generation has it better than the current. It doesn't look promising with the current so-called, self-named conservative, christian majority.
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  #74  
Old 06-11-2012, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wizard24 View Post
If the best he could do was oversee 4 years of $1 Trillion plus deficits and over $16 Trillion deficit in total at the end of 4 years (when he promised to cut said deficit in half), have less Americans holding jobs today than when he took office, produce 3 budgets that have garnered exactly ZERO votes in either house, oversee the first US sovereign debt downgrade in American history, have the lowest home ownership rate since the mid-60s, add nearly 20 million people onto the food stamp program, have the percentage of taxpayers be the lowest % on record, and have his signature piece of legislation about to be ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court . . . I have to ask, WHY DOES HE STILL HAVE YOUR VOTE??
Because, McCain, Romney nor any other Republican care about any of the issues that you mention. They care more about lower tax rates on the wealthy than addressing any issues that our nation face. His real problem was that Obama trying to work with the Republican congress and all they were interested in was to keep him from being re-elected. Go ahead and keep voting for the Republicans, the self-named Conservatives. But, be ready for more movement of individuals from the middle-class to the lower-class. Hillary and Bill tried to convince everyone that health-care needed addressed in the early to mid-90s but it didn't become an issue until "your" health-care goes away or costs to much.

"If they would rather die,'' said Scrooge, "they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population."

I desire that the next generation has it better than the current. It doesn't look promising with the current so-called, self-named conservative, christian majority.
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  #75  
Old 06-11-2012, 03:10 PM
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Sorry for the double post!
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  #76  
Old 06-11-2012, 04:37 PM
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Please BigIron, Wizard addressed you with #'s and facts, you came back with opinions and emotionalism.

Really? Quoting Scrooge?

And further, your one statement was particularly wrong:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
His real problem was that Obama trying to work with the Republican congress and all they were interested in was to keep him from being re-elected.
He had a majority in the House his first two years and he has had a majority in the Senate his ENTIRE term. He passed many of the key items he talked about when campaigning.

He has had the following major pieces of legislation pass the Congress and be signed into law:
American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (Stimulus)
Car Allowance Rebate System (Cash for Clunkers)
Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (Obamacare)
Dodd–Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act
Unemployment Compensation Extension Act of 2010

And although TARP was passed under President Bush, President Obama was involved in the GM bailout with TARP funds (among other things).

When you say that Obama has a problem, I am assuming you think that things are not quite right with the country currently?

I feel that I debunked your theory of Obama's problem, so I am curious to know, what exactly is his problem?

-----

Edit:

Some legislation that he attempted to get through;

Employee Free Choice Act of 2009 (Card Check) - a Union bill that was blocked by Democrats when they had a majority in the Senate after having already passed the Hhouse.
American Clean Energy And Security Act of 2009 (Cap and Trade; re: Climate Change) - would have set up an emissions trading system favored by Obama, passed the House in 2009 when he had a majority in both Houses of Congress.
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Last edited by Commander; 06-11-2012 at 04:51 PM.
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  #77  
Old 06-11-2012, 06:28 PM
Wizard24 Wizard24 is offline
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Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
Because, McCain, Romney nor any other Republican care about any of the issues that you mention.
This statement right here makes me think there is no reason trying to discuss this with you because your argument is based on ideology and is not grounded in logic, statistics or facts. To say that not one Republican cares about the deficit, or creating jobs, or entitlement reform, or our credit rating and all that it affects is completely asinine and makes you appear to be nothing more than a drone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
They care more about lower tax rates on the wealthy than addressing any issues that our nation face.
This is complete rubbish. Conservatives want to lower the tax rates across the board and drastically simplify the Tax Code. Yes, this would lower tax rates on the wealthy, but it would lower them for others as well. To say that they want to just help the rich is disingenuous at best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
His real problem was that Obama trying to work with the Republican congress and all they were interested in was to keep him from being re-elected.
I hear this one a lot too, but could you please give me an example of how President tried, “to work with the Republican Congress”? (Which as Commander pointed out has in fact NOT been a Republican Congress for most of his presidency). Yes they were interested in keeping him from being re-elected . . . just as the Democrats were interested in keeping Bush from being re-elected and the Congress before that was interested in keeping Clinton from being re-elected. I mean they even tried to impeach Clinton, and he still managed to “work with the Republican Congress” and got things done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
Hillary and Bill tried to convince everyone that health-care needed addressed in the early to mid-90s but it didn't become an issue until "your" health-care goes away or costs to much.
I have absolutely no idea what this means.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
I desire that the next generation has it better than the current. It doesn't look promising with the current so-called, self-named conservative, christian majority.
The child that was born just this morning inherited over $50,325 in federal debt. If he had been born 4 years ago it would have been $32,491 (a 55% increase). He is 51% more likely to be fed by using Food Stamps and 23% more likely to be brought home to a house in foreclosure. If we keep on the current path the next generation will most definitely NOT have it better.
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"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law." - Galations 5:22-23
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  #78  
Old 06-11-2012, 08:43 PM
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Ahh, to be young again and so certain of my views.


When the Republicans controlled the White House, the Senate and the House, did the deficit go down or up? Do they walk the walk or only talk the talk?


I believe that a progressive tax code is the only fair tax code. People, including me, who have achieved a certain level of success and realize the American Dream should enjoy supporting the programs that have made the country great. The greater that we have benefited, the greater taxes we should pay.


I believe that we need more regulation of the banking industry (and, many other industries).


I believe that an one-payer healthcare system would have been better than Obamacare but Obamacare is better than what we had.


I believe that most do not realize that they are only one healthcare issue away from or a few paychecks away from needing the programs that they are so against.


I do not believe that government is a bad word and that the private sector always does a better job than government.


I guess that I haven't supplied the logic, statistics or facts that you require but I'm sure they are just a few google seaches away.
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  #79  
Old 06-11-2012, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Commander View Post
When you say that Obama has a problem, I am assuming you think that things are not quite right with the country currently?

I feel that I debunked your theory of Obama's problem, so I am curious to know, what exactly is his problem?
No, what I meant was that he should have been more aggressive in trying to pass his legislation in his first two years even though he didn't have a filibuster proof majority.

Normally, when a president wins the election, he has 100 days where congress allows most of his legislation to pass. Obama did not have any honeymoon with the Republicans in Congress.

If he had passed his measures and things went bust, he should take the blame.

However, he should take the blame for not passing more of his measures.
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  #80  
Old 06-12-2012, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
When the Republicans controlled the White House, the Senate and the House, did the deficit go down or up? Do they walk the walk or only talk the talk?
Agreed, I don't get too excited about Republicans either since most are not as conservative as I am and as you mentioned, many don't walk the walk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigironcross View Post
I believe that a progressive tax code is the only fair tax code. People, including me, who have achieved a certain level of success and realize the American Dream should enjoy supporting the programs that have made the country great. The greater that we have benefited, the greater taxes we should pay.
Our system is already very progressive. In fact, some analysts feel it is more progressive than other countries:

The top 10% of earners in the U.S. pay 35% more of the income tax burden than in Sweden and 22% more than in France. These figures—from the 2008 OECD publication "Growing Unequal?"—include all household taxes imposed on income at the federal, state and local level, including social insurance taxes

Taken from:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...658158454.html
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