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Old 02-25-2011, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superbilt View Post
I think people are addressing the wrong issues in Wisconsin. The people are protesting to keep their collective bargaining rights. Most people are willing to pay something for health care and pensions.
I agree that they are protesting for collective bargaining rights, I addressed that here:

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/forum...postcount=1387

The big issue in Wisconsin today is whether or not public sector workers should have collective bargaining rights. In an Aug. 16, 1937 letter to Luther Steward, the president of the National Federation of Public Employees, President Franklin Delano Roosevelt had something to say about that:

Meticulous attention should be paid to the special relationships and obligations of public servants to the public itself and to the Government.

All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations.

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And from Heritage:

The founders of the labor movement viewed unions as a vehicle to get workers more of the profits they help create. Government workers, however, don’t generate profits. They merely negotiate for more tax money. When government unions strike, they strike against taxpayers. FDR considered this “unthinkable and intolerable.”

Further, Governor Scott Walker is not attempting to take away the right to collectively bargain on wages, just on pensions and benefits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by superbilt View Post
We are facing a similar issue here in NJ because the politicians have been robbing the pension system for years. We pay 5.5% of our salary to our pensions and 1.5% of our salary for healthcare. The flaw in that is someone making $30k pays far less than the person who makes $80k for the same health coverage. The rich are trying to turn this into class warfare and a private vs. public battle. Instead of people unifying to fight for their rights they are being divided. United we stand but divided we destroy ourselves and the middle class.
Well, if you look at the numbers above in the chart (post 1391), there definitely is a private vs. public issue. Even if the union members are willing to pay more for insurance and towards their pension, they are still far below what private citizens are paying.

What do you mean by the "rich" are trying to turn this into class warfare?

1) The median income of the average taxpayer in Wisconsin is less than the majority of the union teachers who are out there protesting.

Quote:
Wisconsin teachers are paid an average salary of $51,000. Annualized to account for their 180-day work year, that’s $68,000, and that is in addition to their very fine benefits, pensions, and job security. The median household income — that is, total household income, including households with two or more earners — was $49,993 in 2009 in Wisconsin.
2) Obama has sided with the unions in this, he's not exactly poor nor does he represent the poor.

3) Gov. Walker openly campaigned on this and was elected by 52% of the population of Wisconsin.

4) I am personally not rich

And here is what I think people are not addressing or acknowledging:

The people of Wisconsin spoke in November 2010 and voted in people who represent their values, if that means Governor Walker gets his legislation through, so be it, if he doesn't, so be it. But you have to do your job, not live in a motel across state lines.

Regardless of what anyone's stance on this issue is, I hope we can agree that it is cowardly for Democrats to run across state lines so they don't have to participate in the legislative process.

Sorry, that is not how the democratic process works. If you don't have enough votes to stop Governor Walker....guess what, then you don't stop him. Running away is not the solution, debate the legislation, offer alternatives, but get back to work.
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Last edited by Commander; 02-25-2011 at 07:53 PM.
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