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-   -   Is fish oil actually hurting us!? (http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95586)

xdisciplex 09-25-2012 12:40 AM

Is fish oil actually hurting us!?
 
Hi guys,
I don't know what to think right now. I heard about a new study showing that fish oil is useless and as I was googling for it I found all these studies saying that fish oil and generally unsaturated fats are bad.

This article says that unsaturated fats are very vulnerable to heat and oxidation and that within the human body it's too hot which will cause the unsaturated fat to oxidize. This would mean that taking fish oil would cause more oxidation.

http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/tem...e-of-oils.html

And this article here seems to claim that fish oil can cause alzheimer disease.

http://www.functionalps.com/blog/201...-degeneration/

I have been taking fish oil daily for many years now and thought that this is good and now I wonder what if the fish oil turns rancid once it's in the body?

DannyB 09-25-2012 10:21 AM

I have read the same article from functionalps.com just yesterday and I find it very interesting. If you go around the site you'll find a lot of other unconventional articles. They take most of the informations from Ray Peat, phD and you can find other insights in his website (http://raypeat.com), but it's not very easy to understand!

xdisciplex 09-25-2012 08:31 PM

Hello, I have been to Peat's website, too. But I dont know what to think of this. What if he's wrong? Shall I now only eat saturated fats or what? This drags me down. :(

Algavinn 09-26-2012 03:43 AM

I'm always interested in new bits of information and research, afterall I am pursuing a career in dietetics (note that I am at the very beginning of it). However, many years of epidemiology have shown connections between unsaturated fats and health benefits, while saturated, trans fats, and cholesterol (LDL anyway) have shown severe health detriments. Given that fish oil is not an artificial source, even if not inside the fish itself, I tend to doubt reports of these kinds. Not to the considerable amount of monetizaton on his blog...


"This makes the fat of these animals entirely healthy for both them and us. There is one caveat, however: Nowadays, the establishment is trying to make fats 'healthier' by feeding animals with commercially produced foodstuffs that contain high levels of polyunsaturated seed oils, notably from soya and maize (corn). "


Saturated fat is never 'entirely healthy' for us. We have nothing but studies showing how badly it can lead to damage in our circulatory system, ending in strokes, heart attacks, complications with things like diabetes, etc. Also...the establishment feeds animals commercially produced foodstuffs, especially corn, because it fattens the animals up in a FAR quicker time, to a FAR greater level. A chicken a hundred years ago and one now is 'ready' in around half the time and is 2-3x as big. Many animals raised for their meat would die not long after because of the unnatural corn diet.

Saturated fat=bad.
unsaturated fats=good in the right amounts and balances.

DannyB 09-26-2012 11:48 AM

Hey Algavinn, what do you think about these research?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7615205
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9397995
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22968891
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14624027
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15820615
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19818397
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10355854

Algavinn 09-26-2012 07:26 PM

I assume you mean their conclusions and not their methodology. Methodology and comparison to numerous other studies is not something I have the time to look into at the moment, but as far as conclusions I find them generally unimportant to the topic at hand. There will always be a outliers and specific cases where a generally harmful agent may be useful, such as the highly toxic nature of 'chemo' meds and radiation therapy. However, saturated fats are negative dietary elements in the normal range healthy body, and unsaturated fats are generally good.

There are vast differences between mono and polyunsaturated fats, of course, and the balance and amounts of these is also important. Any vitamin, mineral, or fat, including the 'hallowed' linolenic omega 3, will either cause harm or do no extra benefit, while things like saturated and trans fats, as well as LDL cholesterol have the potential to be negative, if not harmful, at nominal levels.

For studies that found no health benefits to unsaturated fats, there are studies that do, enough of an abundance in adequate quality for me to use that as my baseline. There are counter-results to nearly every study.

Also, as I mentioned, the fish oil are authentic non-manufactured ingredients, though they are still supplements. Supplements are not synonymous to standard dietary digestion of the source foods. I have nonetheless seen many studies with strong results for the positive effects of fish oil. I personally prefer using flax seed oil for my linolenic supplementation, but either way. Vitamin E, selenium and omega 3 supplementation are some of the most grounded and certain supplements in terms of demonstrated benefits.




These studies listed are useful, but they are not addressing normal standard 98.5%+ of the public. We are not talking about malnourished, alcoholic, or other special condition/category diets the majority of the time.

DannyB 09-26-2012 07:53 PM

I see what you mean and I agree that there are counter-results to every study, in fact I think that the best way to go is "everything in moderation"!
Anyway, I think that some Ray Peat's thoughts are really interesting and reasonable and my take-home points from his studies are:
- add coconut oil to my diet
- take vitamin e (even if I think I take enought vitamin e from italian extra vergin olive oil)
- try aspirin and baking soda before-wo
-add l-glycine to my post-wo shake (even if he doesn't recommend isolated aa and prefers gelatin as a source of glycine )

Algavinn 09-26-2012 08:12 PM

I have heard things about coconut oil but haven't looked into it extensively yet, but I'm going through a period where my diet is ****e and I know it, but a month more and all will be rectified.

the aspirin and baking soda sounds interesting to say the least, have a link?

DannyB 09-26-2012 11:54 PM

These are some links... if I find others links I'll post them!
http://www.functionalps.com/blog/201...n-performance/
http://www.functionalps.com/blog/201...-and-exercise/
http://www.functionalps.com/blog/201...d-performance/
http://raypeat.com/articles/aging/as...n-cancer.shtml

JackAttack 10-05-2012 01:28 AM

Very interesting. I'll read it. Can't say with an open mind though. I eat so much fish I probably don't need to supplement with fish oil.


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