Is smoking Sining?

[kokokolo]

For some reason I think most people and myself view smoking as something that is a sin. But as far as I know this isnt even biblical. If somethng is a sin just because it is unhealthy is would also be a sin to eat fast food/deep fried food, candy, sodas etc.

I know this is a random post especially on a bodybuilding board... Just curious if anyone had any thoughts.

[desperad0]

Well it comes back to the part in the bible where it saids your body is the temple of God.
Smoking harms your body big time, and not only does it harm yourself but people around you.
Its like pretty mcuh killing eveyrone around you.
So even if it is not directly in the bible, its pretty plain and simple. Your body is God's not our own.

[JTiger]

I don't think it's a sin becasue it doesn't cloud you mind to hamper your relationship with God, if you want to compare it with alcohol. Sure it harms your body, but so does most food or even breathing the air in a major city with pollution problems.

[desperad0]

However, you gotta realize what is controllable and what is uncontrollable.
I can so no to smoking and alcohol but can i say no to pollution, or can i say no to sun rays?
Yes i do agree that most food is bad for you thats why we bodybuild and eat healthy. I wouldn't say eating bad is a sin, but than when you eat too mcuh of it = glutton. you gotta kinda step back and see whats good for you and whats not.

[JTiger]

[ QUOTE ]
However, you gotta realize what is controllable and what is uncontrollable.
I can so no to smoking and alcohol but can i say no to pollution, or can i say no to sun rays?
Yes i do agree that most food is bad for you thats why we bodybuild and eat healthy. I wouldn't say eating bad is a sin, but than when you eat too mcuh of it = glutton. you gotta kinda step back and see whats good for you and whats not.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess my point was where does smoking interfere with your relationship with God? I contend that it does not.


For the record I am not a smoker.

[l0stsheep]

I think it is a sin for a few reasons.

First, desperad0 brought up a good point. In I Corinthians Paul tells is twice that our Bodies are the temple of God. The most popular verses are in Chapter 6:

"Do you not know that your body is the Temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore, honor God with your body." (vv. 19, 20 NIV)

The other time, which I find a little more compelling, is in Chapter 3:

"Don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's Spirit lives in you? If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy him; for God's temple is sacred, and you are that temple." (vv. 16, 17 NIV)

With this in mind, you have to look at the affects smoking has on your body. It ruins your lungs, your teeth...and so on. Essentially, the act of smoking doesn't benefit you, but has many negative affects on your body, which is God's temple. Look through Exodus 25-27 and see how meticulous God is with the tabernacle he told Moses to build. God did the opposite of saying, "Just do whatever you think is best." He laid out every detail and commanded Moses to make it exactly how He wanted it. Why? Because there would be no other building that would house the creator of the Universe. In the same way, do we realize how precious our bodies have become now that the Spirit lives inside of us? I think we should strive not to be frivolous with what we do with God's temple.

Again in I Corinthians Paul says, "All things are lawful for me, but not all things are helpful; all things are lawful for me, but not all things edify." (10:23) So, like I said, we have to look at if smoking is helpful for us. It doesn't help us come closer to God, or help us grow spiritually. So why do it? The Christian life is likened to a race throughout the New Testament. Paul talks about leaving things behind and pressing on toward the Goal of Heaven (Phil. 3:14) And in Hebrews 12:1 we read,

"Therefore we also, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which so easily ensnares us, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us."

We are encouraged to let go of the things that do not help us in order to run a better race. Smoking, would be like running a race with a gas mask on. It sure wouldn't help! But on top of not benefiting us, smoking can also lead others away from Christ.

In Romans 14:14-20 Paul talks about not doing things which bothers others or could lead for others to stumble. He talks about not eating meat, as that was common for some people to do at that time, but this idea applies to anything.

"Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall." (vv. 19-21 NIV)

No non-smoker wants to be around smoke. Aside from the fact that you are actually hurting them physically, the act of smoking could hinder them spiritually. If you want to share the gospel with someone, yet you smell of smoke, or are smoking at the time, they won't want to talk with you or listen to what you have to say. Of course, if they don't want to hear the gospel because of smoke, that is a very poor reason, but as Christians we want to do everything we can to not deter people from Christ. Smoking, then, can destroy the work of God because it can turn people away from you and what you, as a Christian, have to say.

To me, smoking is a lust of the flesh. Something your flesh desires which has no benefit for the spirit. Therefore, I think it is good not to smoke. But is it a sin? There are no passages in the Bible that say, "Thou shalt not smoke." Yet I do think it is a sin.

James put it this way, "Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins." (4:17 NIV)

[rickck48]

Beleive it or not, I have Preached on this before. Smoking to me is a sin because, if take your temple and it gets cancer or other hinderence due to smoking it is stopping the body from serving the Lord in future. To that it is sining, anything that can prevent you from serving is wrong in my opinion and no I don't go out makin up messages, I believe on messages being delieverd. God luckk in your quest for your answer, and I do hope God Blesses on ths cause some in my church smokes and they don't think it is wrong. /forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[desperad0]

were suppose to be ambassadors for Christ, and we have to show to the world we are different in good ways.
I think smoking might alter how people view Christians

[Adam Knowlden]

We are supposed to glorify God in all that we do...how does willingly ingesting carcinogens glorify God?

[kokokolo]

smoking does not glorify god. the thing is to me smoking doesnt seem any different to me than going to mcdonalds!
deep fried french fries, coke, burger ...

Large French Fries 6 oz (170 g) 570cals 30g fat
Double Quarter Pounder® with Cheese++ 9.9 oz (280 g) 730cal 40g fat
Coca-Cola® Classic (Large)§ 32 fl oz cup 310 cal
McFlurry® with M&M'S® Candies (12 fl oz cup) 12.3 oz (348 g) 620cal 20g fat

I remember I used to go mcdonals a lot

I always got the large dbl quarter pounder meal and a large M&M mcflurry... It was awesome, although not filling and i was hungry less than an hour later

2230 calories total :/

[JTiger]

[ QUOTE ]
smoking does not glorify god. the thing is to me smoking doesnt seem any different to me than going to mcdonalds!
deep fried french fries, coke, burger ...

Large French Fries 6 oz (170 g) 570cals 30g fat
Double Quarter Pounder® with Cheese++ 9.9 oz (280 g) 730cal 40g fat
Coca-Cola® Classic (Large)§ 32 fl oz cup 310 cal
McFlurry® with M&M'S® Candies (12 fl oz cup) 12.3 oz (348 g) 620cal 20g fat

I remember I used to go mcdonals a lot

I always got the large dbl quarter pounder meal and a large M&M mcflurry... It was awesome, although not filling and i was hungry less than an hour later

2230 calories total :/

[/ QUOTE ]

You're correct, smoking does NOT glorify God, but are we to condemn those to hell that eat at McDonald's too? I think not.

I stand by my earlier statement that it is not a sin. I don't think anyone will be denied entry into the kingdom because they smoked a pack a day.

The question is what did you do with your time on earth and did you accept Jesus Christ as your personal savior and Lord.

[Adam Knowlden]

Hi Jtiger, while I respect your opinion, I don't really think comparing junk food to smoking is a good argument.

I don't think the occasional big mac is the same as being addicted to cigarettes. Unless you're a bodybuilder, then yep you're pretty much going to burn! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

But I do think it’s a valid question to ask if it’s a sin to be addicted to something whether it’s smoking, food, or anything.

I have asked smokers why they do it, basically they state they use it to relive stress (which seems like circular reasoning as their stress is probably related to nicotine withdrawal), or they'll just admit they're addicted.

For me this is a lust issue. Lust is bondage and I can't find a biblical way to justify addiction. I don't believe a smoker who is trying to quite; God is waiting to strike them with a thunderbolt. But I believe acknowledging something is a sin is the first step. God can't work with you until you give Him your life. If for example, you're still holding on to your cigarette addiction and won't give him Lordship in that area, the Holy Spirit can't work to free you. That's pretty much the same with any sin. You can read more about this in our JHR article on paradigms here.

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/markingstrategy.php

Also I don't really believe we are condemning anyone here, we're just seeing if its a sin.
/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Venom]

I do think it is a sin. But I think this is largely beside the point.

I compare this to when a Christian says that they don’t have to go to church in order to be saved. No you don’t. But by eliminating things such as church in your life, you are not going to optimize your Christian life. And ultimately, this should be our goal: to reach our spiritual potential in Christ. Not to be saved by fire and have no rewards in heaven.

So as Lostsheep says, if we know what is right, and don’t do it, then that is a sin.

[ QUOTE ]
If somethng is a sin just because it is unhealthy is would also be a sin to eat fast food/deep fried food, candy, sodas etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, look at it from a standpoint of optimizing yourself as a Christian, rather than condemning someone. If you have a cheat food everyonce in a while, that is not a big deal. But if you live on this stuff, you are killing yourself, and may become obese. This can impair your ability to do a ton of stuff. Clearly this is not optimal as a Christian. I will discuss why stuff like this can become a sin, similar to smoking soon.

When I follow scripture, I don’t do it “just because” remember: God tells us commands that are BEST for us. He does not tell us to do things just to do them. His commands are logical, and fruitful when followed.




Psalms 1:1-3
1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful. 2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. 3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.

3 John 1:2
2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.


God wants us to be prosperous and successful people. And if we follow his word, he promises that we shall be.

Now, let’s analyze if smoking is what God wants us to do according to his word. If he does not want us to do it, why not.

First, I would say from a health standpoint.

Others have quoted some great scriptures above on this.

Let me show how smoking can hinder both your health, and our goals as bodybuilders.

SMOKINGS EFFECTS ON HEALTH AND PERFORMANCE


PhD Paul Roetert in the Journal of Strength an conditioning states that:

[ QUOTE ]
IN OUR PROFESSION, WE frequently tell clients and others that smoking and being overweight are detrimental to health.

[/ QUOTE ]


Here is an example,

Meyer et al. looked at the association between BMI and mortality and evaluated the effect of physical activity during leisure time. In addition, they studied the effect of smoking on this association in males.


Men with BMI greater than 30 had more than 50% increased mortality compared with men whose BMI was between 22 and 25. In each category of BMI, the mortality among smokers was much higher compared with that among ex-smokers and never-smokers. Irrespective of BMI level, ex- and never-smokers had lower mortality than current smokers did.

Meyer, H.E., A.J. Sogaard, A. Tverdal, and R.M. Selmer. Body mass index and mortality: The influence of physical activity and smoking. Med. Sci. Sports Exerc. 34:(7) 1065–1070. 2002.

When analyzing this, Dr. Paul stated:

[ QUOTE ]
The finding by Meyer et al. (1) that ex-and never-smokers had lower mortality than current smokers did, irrespective of BMI level, is in agreement with other studies. This finding points out that smoking is a greater health hazard than obesity . In addition, the absolute risk associated with obesity increases markedly if it is combined with smoking.

[/ QUOTE ]

This short review article

Robert H. Coker, Stanley P. Brown, Linda F. Chitwood and William B. Keith. 1996: Nicotine Use and Athletic Performance: A Brief Review. The Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research: Vol. 10, No. 4, pp. 279–282.


Pointed out numerous studies that smoking greatly decreased athletic performance, including: increased blood lactate concentrations, decreased the time to exhaustion, decreased stroke volume (how much blood your heart pumps out of the heart each minute) among numerous other side effects.


Probably the most popular side effect from smoking is lung cancer. The National Cancer Institute has this to say:

[ QUOTE ]
Tobacco use, particularly cigarette smoking, is the single most preventable cause of death in the United States. Cigarette smoking alone is directly responsible for approximately 30 percent of all cancer deaths annually in the United States (1). Cigarette smoking also causes chronic lung disease (emphysema and chronic bronchitis), cardiovascular disease, stroke, and cataracts. Smoking during pregnancy can cause stillbirth, low birthweight, Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS), and other serious pregnancy complications (2). Quitting smoking greatly reduces a person’s risk of developing the diseases mentioned, and can limit adverse health effects on the developing child.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Cigarette smoking causes 87 percent of lung cancer deaths (1). Lung cancer is the leading cause of cancer death in both men and women (3). Smoking is also responsible for most cancers of the larynx, oral cavity and pharynx, esophagus, and bladder. In addition, it is a cause of kidney, pancreatic, cervical, and stomach cancers (2, 4), as well as acute myeloid leukemia (2).

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
# What harmful chemicals are found in cigarette smoke?

Cigarette smoke contains about 4,000 chemical agents, including over 60 carcinogens (8). In addition, many of these substances, such as carbon monoxide, tar, arsenic, and lead, are poisonous and toxic to the human body. Nicotine is a drug that is naturally present in the tobacco plant and is primarily responsible for a person’s addiction to tobacco products, including cigarettes. During smoking, nicotine is absorbed quickly into the bloodstream and travels to the brain in a matter of seconds. Nicotine causes addiction to cigarettes and other tobacco products that is similar to the addiction produced by using heroin and cocaine (9).

[/ QUOTE ]


This article here in the journal of applied physiology

G. L. Hirsch, D. Y. Sue, K. Wasserman, T. E. Robinson, and J. E. Hansen
Immediate effects of cigarette smoking on cardiorespiratory responses to exercise

Found that smoking decreased practically every measurement of performance during cardiovascular exercise. It decreased oxygen delivery, increased heart rate dramatically, among other side effects. This is directly transferable to weight training.



So clearly, smoking is horrible for health and performance.
DRUGS AND SPIRITUAL LIFE

Adam has made several convincing posts that recreational drugs are condemned by scripture.


19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


Gal 5:20

Sorcery/witchcraft, is from the Greek word, "Pharmakia" the same word we get pharmacy from. It means the general illicit use of drugs (same application as today) and the use of drugs to cast spells etc.

Illicit drugs destroy the body and are condemned: 1 Cor 3:16; 6:19.


Now, God does not tell us to do anything without a purpose. The reasons include:

Illicit drugs are condemned because its fruit is rotten. Matthew 7:17f Rotten fruits include: its effects on health and performance as mentioned above. It also becomes a form of idolatry.

Also, a lot of people turn to drugs and junk food, as purely from lusts of the flesh (a sin as mentioned above) or for stress relief. This is a form of idolatry. You are putting drugs above God by yielding to drugs for strength. Instead of relying on drugs during hard times, turn to God!

I liked this quote by deserado

[ QUOTE ]

were suppose to be ambassadors for Christ, and we have to show to the world we are different in good ways.
I think smoking might alter how people view Christians

[/ QUOTE ]

The final, and probably worst problem, is that it greatly hurts your testimony. Christ said we are to be the light of the world, and ambassadors unto him. When people see you, who proclaim to be a Christian, smoking, drinking, etc. it already discredits your testimony in their eyes. It is like seeing someone who is obese saying they are a bodybuilder.

Here is a great quote from old school

[ QUOTE ]
I Cor. 3:

16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.

19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

21 Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are your's;

22 Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are your's;

23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.



Psychologically, drugs can cause us to lose all sense of control. We switch our entire dependence and reason for living to the chemical. The Bible teaches in I Corinthians 6:19-20 that God has given us our bodies; our bodies belong to Him. We are also told in Romans 12:1 that we are to present our bodies a living sacrifice to God". Can we do this and be drug dependent?

Should you use as a believer use drugs or alcohol?

1.Will my faith grow stronger or weaker?
2.Will my Savior be glorified? (Colossians 3:17)
3.Will it build my mind and body for service to God? (1 Corinthians 9:24-27)

How does God feel about substance abuse?

Isaiah 5:11-12.

11 Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them!

12 And the harp, and the viol, the tabret, and pipe, and wine, are in their feasts: but they regard not the work of the LORD, neither consider the operation of his hands.

Who does our body belong to?
What is it that God wants his children to do with their bodies?

Corinthians 6:19-20.

19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

What does God say about people who give into heavy drinking or drug use?
Is God "for" or "against" the misuse of drugs and alcohol?

Galatians 5:19-20

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

Drug use is a form of witchcraft in God's eyes.

The Bible mentions four powerful drugs, three that are stronger than LSD. They are wormwood, hemlock, gall and myrrh. None are ever used to induce visions of the Bible God. No prophet of God ever used drugs to speak or listen to God in the Scriptures. Anything that takes away the conscious control of our minds or feelings is a sin against our souls. No one has a right to put himself at the mercy of a chemical that opens the door of the mind to the spirit world outside of Christ.

It's a way for our mind to ascend to a different plane. Away from God. Let's look closer at Gal 5:20

Sorcery/witchcraft, is from the Greek word, "Pharmakia" the same word we get pharmacy from. It means the general illicit use of drugs (same application as today) and the use of drugs to cast spells etc.It also means "to make religious trips by the use of drugs."

1. "Who are the two drug dealers of the Bible?" Elymas and Simon: Acts 13:6 ; Acts 8:9

a. Notice this is illustrative of what Gal 5:20 condemns. These men, called sorcerers, magicians, witchcraft.

b. Harper's bible dictionary says: "On the lowest level were the "imposters"(2 Tim. 3:13) who played their tricks as do circus magicians today. Between these were the sorcerers, enchanters, and charmers who could cast spells and knew how to use herbs, potions, and drugs."

c. W. E. Vine says, "In sorcery, the use of drugs, whether simple or potent, was generally accompanied by incantations and appeals to occult powers, with the provision of various charms, amulets, etc., professedly designed to keep the applicant or patient from the attention and power of demons, but actually to impress the applicant with the mysterious resources and powers of the sorcerer."

d. So like a witch that stirs her pot of secret brewing herbs, who then takes a small bottle of the potion and gives it to someone, so too with Elymas and Simon. The witch was a drug dealer. Simon would give hallucinogen drugs like "THC" (cannabis) "Psylocibin" or "Cybelcyblin" (magic mushroom) "Cocaine", "Heroin" (poppy plant) to someone, wait a few minutes then as the drug starts to set in, start waving his hands around giving the impression that HIS POWER is causing all magical visions.

I also believe Jesus was offered drugs at his death!

If this wasn't temptation then I don't know what is!

Where was Jesus offered drugs and refused?": on the cross "Gall" Mt 27:34.

a. The Jerome Bible commentary says at Mt 27:34: "It was the practice of Jewish women to offer a strong narcotic drink to men condemned to execution; Jesus refused this."

b. Matthew Henry comments: "By the drink they provided for him before he was nailed to the cross, v. 34. It was usual to have a cup of spiced wine for those to drink of, that were to be put to death, according to Solomon's direction (Prov. 31:6, 7), Give strong drink to him that is ready to perish"

c. Lensky says at Mt 27:34, "34) Regarding the actual crucifixion Matthew and Mark report only the offer of doped wine which Jesus refused. Matthew calls it wine mixed with Gall. This was not actual gall, but the drink was so called because of its bitter taste. Mark reports that the drink was wine mixed with myrrh, and this tells us what the bitter substance was. Myrrh was added to the wine in order to give it a stupefying effect. This was not an evidence of mercy on the part of the executioners; it was quite the opposite, for it was intended to make their labor of crucifying easier. A man who had been heavily doped with this drink could be easily handled. After one taste of this Jesus refused to drink more of this stupefying drink, and the imperfect [Greek] reads as though he was repeatedly urged to drink and as repeatedly refused. He intended to go through the final ordeal with a perfectly clear mind; he intended to endure all without avoiding a single agony. After a generous drink of this wine Jesus could not have spoken as he did and made his death what it was.

Finally, Notice that any drug use exceeds the line of drunkenness of the Bible.

One joint is equal the impairment effect of 3 beers.
One shroom is equal the impairment effect of 5 beers.
One dose of is Mescaline is equal the impairment effect of 5 beers.
One snort of Cocaine is equal the impairment effect of 7 beers.
One Ecstasy pill is equal the impairment effect of 6 beers.

God commands us to be of a sound mind. This automatically eliminates any psychoactive drugs.

2 Tim. 1:

7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

1 Peter 1:

13 Wherefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and hope to the end for the grace that is to be brought unto you at the revelation of Jesus Christ;

14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:

15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

16 Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Venom]

[ QUOTE ]

I have asked smokers why they do it, basically they state they use it to relive stress (which seems like circular reasoning as their stress is probably related to nicotine withdrawal), or they'll just admit they're addicted.


[/ QUOTE ]

The thing is it is the WORST stress reliever possible!!! As I showed above, smoking increases practically every marker of stress! This includes blood pressure, heart rate, decreased stroke volume, various catabolic hormones.

It is just comfort foods. People turn to drugs or food to help comfort themselves from the stress, but it does not help.

What needs to be understand is that using smoking is just a comfort to your pain. It is NOT a solution to your pain.

It’s like this: you have a big gash in your arm, after cutting yourself, and all you do is put a plastic Band-Aid over it. Worst yet, you put a dirty Band-Aid (e.g. smoking) that makes it worst.

This is what our society has bread: pop a pill. This is our solution to EVERYTHING.

I will say this very emphatically: popping a pill is NEVER the solution. In fact, it becomes the problem.

If you want to get rid of your stress, then that can be done. But comfort drugs are only going to hurt you.

These articles tell how to effectively relieve stress.

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/exercisestress5.php

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/exercisestress6.php


Matthew 11:28-30
28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

We should turn to God in times of stress; not drugs.

[Adam Knowlden]

[ QUOTE ]
When I follow scripture, I don’t do it “just because” remember: God tells us commands that are BEST for us. He does not tell us to do things just to do them. His commands are logical, and fruitful when followed.


[/ QUOTE ]

That is an excellent point Venom. The church example is a perfect analogy.

For example, when Israel was in the wilderness, they were still addicted to being slaves.

God commanded them to rest. Toiling with no rest is not healthy, but they still refused. They didn't trust God to take care of them.

Now, the children of Israel were supposed to gather enough manna for two days on Friday, to bide them over until Sunday. Saturday was the sabbath and they were supposed to rest. Why? Just to follow a law? No. It was for their benefit as Venom has been pointing out. The body was not made to work 24/7.

<font color="red"> 18And when they did mete it with an omer, he that gathered much had nothing over, and he that gathered little had no lack; they gathered every man according to his eating.

19And Moses said, Let no man leave of it till the morning.

20Notwithstanding they hearkened not unto Moses; but some of them left of it until the morning, and it bred worms, and stank: and Moses was wroth with them.

21And they gathered it every morning, every man according to his eating: and when the sun waxed hot, it melted.

22And it came to pass, that on the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for one man: and all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.

23And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.

24And they laid it up till the morning, as Moses bade: and it did not stink, neither was there any worm therein.

25And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day is a sabbath unto the LORD: to day ye shall not find it in the field.

26Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.

27And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.

28And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws? </font>

The Sabbath is pretty much the most debated topic, do we have to keep the sabbath? The issue is why have it in the first place? To honor God with your body.

If you have no rest you cannot optimally serve God. Its not a burden, its for our benefit.

Why is it a law though God? To make life difficult?
No, the Lord gave man the Sabbath, that is the key here. God's commands are a gift for our benefit, not to make life a burden. God's the yoke remover, not the burden giver!


<font color="red"> 29See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.

30So the people rested on the seventh day.
</font>

God's law provides a light for us. Most of the time we don't even know what's best for us. We have limited perception and also are corrupted by sin.

Obeying God's laws is really a matter of trust. Do you trust God to know what is best for you? If He's your Lord, not just your Savior, you will.

<font color="blue"> 12And now, Israel, what doth the LORD thy God require of thee, but to fear the LORD thy God, to walk in all his ways, and to love him, and to serve the LORD thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul,

13To keep the commandments of the LORD, and his statutes, which I command thee this day for thy good?

14Behold, the heaven and the heaven of heavens is the LORD's thy God, the earth also, with all that therein is.

</font>

[JTiger]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Jtiger, while I respect your opinion, I don't really think comparing junk food to smoking is a good argument.

I don't think the occasional big mac is the same as being addicted to cigarettes. Unless you're a bodybuilder, then yep you're pretty much going to burn! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

But I do think it’s a valid question to ask if it’s a sin to be addicted to something whether it’s smoking, food, or anything.

I have asked smokers why they do it, basically they state they use it to relive stress (which seems like circular reasoning as their stress is probably related to nicotine withdrawal), or they'll just admit they're addicted.

For me this is a lust issue. Lust is bondage and I can't find a biblical way to justify addiction. I don't believe a smoker who is trying to quite; God is waiting to strike them with a thunderbolt. But I believe acknowledging something is a sin is the first step. God can't work with you until you give Him your life. If for example, you're still holding on to your cigarette addiction and won't give him Lordship in that area, the Holy Spirit can't work to free you. That's pretty much the same with any sin. You can read more about this in our JHR article on paradigms here.

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/markingstrategy.php

Also I don't really believe we are condemning anyone here, we're just seeing if its a sin.
/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting point. I see what you are saying and will read the link later when I get a bit of time to read it. Thanks.

[tarheelsykes]

I have to agree that it can be a sin. Again, there is the damage it causes to the body. But I think the addiction is more of a problem. Chronic smokers are constantly headed towards their next smoke, it disrupts their conversations, their meals with family, etc. it becomes a master to their lives, just like any addiction. We cant serve two masters.

[wb4revival]

Excellent posts!

I believe the person that loves God with ALL their heart, and all their soul and all their mind, will eventually be confronted with the inconsistency of living for Christ while participating in any addictive behavior (fleshly).

Most have probably heard that Charles Spurgeon smoked cigars for many years and protested the thought that it was a sin. As I understand the story, one day he saw his likeness on a billboard ad proclaiming "the kind that Spurgeon smokes" and he quit immediately. He realized the impact his smoking had on other people's lives.

To love God with all our heart and our neighbor as ourselves (equally) is the essence of the moral law of God (Mat. 22:37). The apostle Paul said, "Whether ye eat or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God".

I don't think the true Christian needs a "letter of the law" to tell us what we can and cannot do. We should conduct ourselves as love would demand. Nothing more, nothing less.

These comments are made in love and only for your consideration.

God Bless...

W.B.

[Venom]

That was a very nice post, W.B. Thank you for sharring. /forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ZEN MASHEENE]

I would have to say that for a Christian, smoking is definitely a sin.