Bible Prophecy part III- The Rapture!

[Adam Knowlden]

Welcome to Part 3 in the prophecy series,

"When God's clock strikes midnight!"

The Rapture of the Church!

The Rapture of the Church is one of the greatest promises Jesus has given us as Believers. It offers us hope and comforts us that Jesus has defeated death. He will come again for us someday, before the Great Tribulation of the earth, and snatch up all the believers both alive and dead!

http://www.christiananswers.net/godstory/rapture.jpg

First off, you won't find the word "Rapture"anywhere in the Bible. The word comes from a Latin Translation of "caught up" taken from first Thessalonians and was translated "rapturo"in the Latin Bible.

These are the key points God wants us to be aware about concerning the Rapture:

1. God wants us to be informed about the Rapture.

The Rapture involves far more than a removal of saints. It is first and foremost a return of the Savior in the clouds. Jesus will return prophetically and He will return personally! But it isn't the second coming of Jesus. During the Second Coming the Lord will literally come down to earth, at the Mt. of Olives, where he ascended after his Resurrection. During the Rapture we will "meet the Lord in the air". Again, the rapture is not the second coming, but an intermediary period in between his first and second coming.

Also, understand this: The Rapture is not taught in Matthew, Mark and Luke. You can find it twice in the Gospel of John. Any other time you are reading about Christ's return in the gospels, it is not referring to the Rapture. Instead, these are references to the second phase of Christ's return - when He physically comes back to earth to rule over it after a seven-year Tribulation period and it's called, in theological circles, "the Revelation" or the revealing of Christ upon earth.

Where are the two Rapture texts in the Gospel of John? John 14:1-3: "Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also." This is not His coming to the earth. This is the point at which He receives us unto Himself at the great Rapture - the snatching away - to be with Him in heaven as the seven years of torment occur on earth. The second reference is in John 11:25,26. I quoted this passage for years but didn't really understand it. Christ said: "I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

Jesus is contrasting those who experience death and live again ("for the dead in Christ rise first," I Thessalonians 4:16) with those who never experience death (because "we which are alive and remain" are caught up without dying, I Thessalonians 4:17).

Our Blessed Hope...THE RAPTURE!

I Thess. 4:13

"Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep (those who have died), or to grieve like the rest of men, who have no hope."

This concern came after Paul left the Greek city of Thessalonica. Paul had told the Thessalonians about Christ's return. After Paul had left the city a few of the older Christians died. That made the other Christians wonder about what would happen to their friends when Jesus came back. Would those who died be left out of the glory of Jesus'return?

Paul addresses their concerns in the first letter he wrote them; a letter we call first Thessalonians.

I Thess. 4: 13-18

"13.Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep (those who have died), or to grieve like the rest of men, who have no hope.

14. We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

15. According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.

16. For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.
18. Therefore, encourage each other with these words."

(Before I continue, I want to make one thing clear. There is no such thing as "soul sleep"or some kind of limbo state at death.

In other words, when you die your spirit goes to be with the Lord in heaven. You physical bodies "sleep" in the grave.)

2. The Rapture will come unexpectedly:

The Rapture is a sign-less event.

The rapture happens before the seven year tribulation. The tribulation begins after the rapture when the antichrist signs a peace treaty for seven years (Dan 9:27). The rapture will happen without warning, and the world will be plunged into darkness and the judgments of the day of the Lord.

3. Three sounds will accompany the Rapture. And they will only be heard by those who are saved:

A. There will be a command to get up! "The shout of the Lord"

This is referring to the dead who believed in Christ whose physical bodies are being called up to meet the Lord. Each time the Lord resurrected someone or calls out their spirit, he did it with a loud voice or shout. (John 11:43, Matthew 27:50, 52-53, Rev. 4:1)

B. There will be a cry to give up. "The voice of the Archangel"

This is referring to Satan's defeat. The Bible says Satan is the "Prince of the air". When Christ returns Satan will no doubt try to prevent it. The Bible says we will meet the Lord in the air and the voice of the Archangel will cry out! This will let Satan know he is defeated and Christ has conquered death!

Every refrerence to an archangle in the bible, speaks of Micheal the archangel, who is in charge of fighting against the devil. I believe this shout will be Micheal's victory cry that the "Prince of the air" is defeated!

C. There will be a call to go up. "The Last Trump of God."( I Cor. 15:52)

Finally, the trump of God will sound. This is an analogy of the last trumpet call in the Roman army. When the first trumpet sounded it meant gather up your tents and get dressed, the second trumpet meant to get in formation, and the last trumpet meant move out! This will no doubt be the calling of the remaining saints! We will be called up by the trump of God to meet Jesus in the air!

4. No one knows the day or the hour when the Rapture will take place, NO ONE! This includes Nostradameus, and the likes. There have been many stories of whack-o's who swindle away their life savings, pull their kids out of school, quit their jobs and party, etc. because they think they know the day Jesus will return.

In no way does God encourage that kind of nonsense. Jesus said, "Occupy until I come". Don't give up your dreams because you think the end is near. As Christians we have the knowledge that we have nothing to fear and the Rapture is our Great Hope. The Lord will spare us from his final wrath. Personally, I live with the hope that the Lord will return in my lifetime. In my opinion, things will get much worse before the Lord Returns. But we are to always hope and comfort each other with the promise he made that he will return and take us.

Matthew 24:36

"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, not the Son, but only the Father."

1 Thessalonians 5:1-4

"Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying, "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. But you, brothers, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief."

Imagine the chaos the Rapture will cause! Sudden destruction, disorder and confusion when every believer is suddenly taken away! Satan will provide his antichrist (Just as Jesus was God in the flesh, so the anti-Christ will be Satan in the flesh) to bring order to this confusion, and offer a deceiving explanation as to how it occurred along with peace in the Middle East. This will be discussed more during the Tribulation post.

Many Christians feel that the Rapture will come at the end of the Tribulation or in the middle of it. How Gloomy and depressing that is! I personally feel that it will happen before.

We are not appointed to wrath (I Thess. Chapter 1: 10 and chapter 5, Rev. 3:10).

It's a fact that God always spares His own from judgment. When the horrendous worldwide flood came in Noah's day, Noah told those who were prepared to COME INTO the ark, Genesis 7:7. When the judgment fell on Sodom and Gomorrah in Genesis 19:14, the angels told Lot and his family to COME OUT of the city. Notice this trilogy: In Noah's day, it was COME IN. In Lot's day it was COME OUT. In our day, it will be COME UP, Revelation 4:1.

Also, the Rapture was a mystery.

In 1 Cor. 15 where Paul says:

"Behold, I tell you a mystery.."

The rapture is a "mystery", that is it is a truth that was unknown, or unrevealed, before the Lord revealed it to Paul. And that is where Paul got this doctrine, from Jesus.

Notice what he says:

"For this we say to you by the word of the Lord.." 1Thess 4:15 (see also Gal 1:11-18).

This is one major point that separates the rapture from the Second Coming. The Second Coming is no "mystery", it was known in the Old Testament. The rapture, however, is a mystery because it was a new revelation from God to Paul the Apostle.

To understand the Second Coming of Christ, think of it in two stages:

First Coming:

To earth as a babe.

Intermediary- In the air:

1. The Rapture (Luke 21:36; John 14:1-3; 1Thess 1:10, 4:14-17, 5:9; Rev 3:10)
2. In secrecy
3. Some will see him (I Thess. 5:2)

Second Coming: (more on this in the next post)

1. Armageddon, with his saints. (Zech 14:5; Col 3:4; Rev 19:7-8,14, 21:9-10; Matt 24:29-31; Jud 1:14,15; 1Thess 3:13)
2. In his sovereignty(Rev. 19:11).
3. Everyone will see him (Rev. 1:7, Zech 12:10, Mat 24:30 Luke 3:6 John 19:37)

5. What will happen to us as believers during the Rapture?
This is truly the awesome part!!! Not only is the rapture a sign-less event, there will be no warnings that it is about to occur, the rapture is also a sudden event. That is, the whole thing will happen without warning and be over with just as suddenly.

I Corinthians 15:51 and 52 explains it best!

"Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will be changed-in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed."

Imagine, right now, you are instantly in the air with Jesus! Cool huh! It could happen! Just thinking about that boggles my mind!

The bodies of those who have died and been crumbled to dust will be resurrected and return to life just as Jesus' body was raised from the dead. It doesn't matter how you died, God will put you back together and give you a new body instantly! The new bodies will not age or decay, or die, but will be a body built for eternity!

Christians who are still alive when Jesus returns will not experience physical death. We will be "caught up"; and our bodies will be instantly changed! We will be taken out of this world to be with Jesus forever!

When you go through all the events, Jesus returns, archangel's voice, dead Christians raised to life, living Christians changed and taken out of this world- it sounds like a long event. However, the Bible says it will happen instantly! In the twinkling of an eye!

The twinkling of an eye is not the blink of an eye! Actually faster!

After we are transformed the fulfilling of the prophecy of death being conquered will be fulfilled!

1Cor. 15:54-55

"But when this perishable will have put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immorality, then will come about the saying that is written death is swallowed up in victory. O grave, where is your victory? O Death, where is your sting?"

The bottom line is this: The rapture will happen without warnings or signs, and when it happens it will be very quick and over in an instant. Thus there is no "getting ready", you either will be ready when the rapture happens or you will be left behind to suffer through the wrath of God (the tribulation). That is why today is the day of salvation, you don't know what tomorrow will bring. It may bring death, or rapture.

In summary the Rapture is nothing to fear or wonder about!

"looking for the blessed hope and the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus." Titus 2:13

Why does Paul call the rapture a blessed hope? Because in the doctrine of the rapture we find hope for the future. Not only our future, but also the future of those who we know who die saved.

Another reason the rapture is a blessed hope is because it promises us escape from the wrath to come. The tribulation that will happen following the rapture is a time of wrath, when God pours out His wrath on this earth (Rev. 6:15-17, Zeph. 1:14-18, Joel 2:1-2, Rev. 15:1, 16:1).

This time, He has directly promised that, His church will escape:
"...and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, that is Jesus, who rescues us from the wrath to come." 1Thess 1:10

and,

"Because you have kept the word of My perseverance, I also will keep you from the hour of test, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world to test those who dwell on the earth." (Rev 3:10)

The church will escape, and be kept from, the future tribulation.

God made it clear and we should be happy in the promise he gave us and comfort each other with his promise!
The Rapture is an event for all believers.

Look again at 1 Cor. 15 where Paul says clearly:
"we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed" 15:51
All believers, living and dead, will be raptured. If you are a Christian you will not miss the rapture.

The Rapture will be the largest, longest, loveliest, and loudest family reunion in History! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Archetype]

I am currently reading book two of the nine part series "Left Behind". It is about the Rapture of the church. While I am not sure how much of it is actually biblical, but they are amazing books. I havent actually read your post yet, but after posting this I am going to. I really want to compare what you post to what the books are about. I would highly recommend them.

[Archetype]

Just read it...
Wow, I got goose bumps through almost that entire thing. Its almost scary. I believe in god, whole heartedly, no doubt in my mind I know there is a god. But I have spent no more then a few hours in church in my life, and it worries me. One part of me wants more then anything to become a believer, to give myself fully and totally to god, and yet another part of me is holding me back. Telling me that I am not ready, that I cannot make a commitment of that magnitude without some serious thought.

Scary stuff.....

[President Wilson]

Outstanding Old School! Truly awesome!

Another excellent rapture scripture that corrisponds with Pauls description is here:

First the Excellent Verse You discussed to Thessalonians

[ QUOTE ]
1 Thessalonians says this:. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort F11 one another with these words. <hr /></blockquote>

But in Revelations, I believe that John experiences the rapture, as we will before the tribulation described in Revelation begins.

[ QUOTE ]
Revelation 4:1-7
1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. 2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne. 3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald. <hr /></blockquote>

Just as you stated Old School, the shout that stated to come up. And additionally, the voice as of a trumpet. Very cool indeed! And immediately after John was called up, the tribulation began. Just as he witnessed the tribulation of the future, he first experienced the rapture!

[The 509th]

<blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: Archetype:</font><hr> I am currently reading book two of the nine part series "Left Behind". It is about the Rapture of the church. While I am not sure how much of it is actually biblical, but they are amazing books. I haven't actually read your post yet, but after posting this I am going to. I really want to compare what you post to what the books are about. I would highly recommend them. <hr /></blockquote> I just bought the first book of the Left Behind series this Saturday and I was going to post in Athletes Shooting The Breeze to ask if anyone here has read it. I guess you beat me to it Archetype /forum/images/graemlins/tongue.gif.I just started it, so am curious to reviews of those who read it. It seems to me to be a cross between Stephen Kings The Langoliers [ the airplane part in the beginning] and The Stand from what little I have read on review sites about. So who else here has read it? [Sorry Oldschool, didn't mean to hijack your thread /forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif ]

[Venom]

"of that magnitude without some serious thought."

This other part is a lie. The problem is you are thinking too much.

1 Corinthians 1: 18 - 31

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. 20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. 22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: 23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. 25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. 26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called: 27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; 28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: 29 That no flesh should glory in his presence. 30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: 31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

There is nothing to think about, God has made foolish the wisdom of this world. All you have to do is this:

Romans 10:8-11
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Just confess with you mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved! And trust me you will not be let down! Just take that leap, and realize this.

Hebrews 11:4-31
. 6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

If you have faith in God, and diligently seek after righteousness you shall be rewarded. Christ said any man that comes to me; I will in no wise turn him away. If you seek hunger and thirst after righteousness you will be filled! But you must have faith, for all things are possible to them who believe.

[Venom]

I got to go, but when i come back i will check out your post old school, thanks! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[binski20]

Wow!
Goosebumps. I can't raise any points or debates like others may, because I haven't read the bible. I am just now trying to dedicate my life to Christ, and that is what has been missing. Your post was like a slap in the face saying
" READ IT NOW!!!!"
Thanks man

[Venom]

Awesome post old school! Some very fascinating info.

"Because you have kept the word of My perseverance, I also will keep you from the hour of test, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world to test those who dwell on the earth." (Rev 3:10)

This is a great quote from revelation that Jesus made to the churches.

Revelation 4:1-2
1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. 2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.

This I believe is the rapture itself! Right after Jesus instructs the churches john immediately hears a trumpet (paralleling what Paul says will happen when we are changed) and he is brought up to heaven in the spirit! Also it says I will show what must happen after this, after the rapture of the church. And then we enter into the trial, which Jesus said he would keep us from, that will test the whole world, the revelation. Very cool stuff.

Luke 17:20-37
26 And as it was in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: 27 They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise as it was also in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built; 29 but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 30 Even so will it be in the day when the Son of Man is revealed.

This is a very important verse, because it shows that the end days will parallel Sodom, and the time of Noah. After Noah entered the ark, and after Lot went out of Sodom, Gods wrath came out. As old school pointed out earlier, we were not appointed to wrath. So after we leave or after we are raptured (or gathered up as Paul says) than will the tribulation begin.

Great stuff old school, I will read this several times through.

[Adam Knowlden]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry Oldschool, didn't mean to hijack your thread <hr /></blockquote>

You're not hijacking!
I'm glad you're reading it!

I've never read that series, but my mom has and she says they are awesome!

[Adam Knowlden]

[ QUOTE ]
yet another part of me is holding me back. <hr /></blockquote>

That is your sinful nature holding you back. Your pride, lusts, and comfortable way of living.

The bible calls that the wide road of life.

Bro, once you truely accept and acknowldege Christ your sins are forgiven. That's the thing. People make it out like its so hard or its some secret ritual! Its not. God made it sooo easy! He did all the work, all God wants from us is to admit we are sinners, and accept his free gift.

Once you are born again, you can ask the Lord to baptize you with the Holy Spirit(I'm going to get into this in a future post). When you do this your eyes are opened! You see the world in a totally new way! You begin to see how foolish and lost the ways of this world are. The spirit of the Lord in you is the only thing that can quench your spiritual thirst and bring you true happines. Its true hope.

The bottom line is you have to have faith though and believe Jesus died for you and rose again form the dead. You have to believe it in your heart and say it with your lips. Many can't do it cause they don't want to give up their flesh lusts. The thing is once you have the Holy Ghost in you you seriously don't even want those things anymore and you thank God for opening your eyes.

If you are a believer the rapture is nothing to be afraid of, in fact its our great hope! I can't wait for that day! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Adam Knowlden]

Yeah venom!

I really feel we will be spared the tribulation!

In fact, I'm such a pre-tribulationists, that I won't even eat post cereal anymore!;)

In fact the rapture will be the greatest reunion ever!

What an awesome day that will be!

However, God is long suffering wanting none to perish!

[President Wilson]

That is awesome! And speaking of that. That last scripture I posted is not only amazing for the rapture, but as you said it also speaks of the God heads oneness. What amazed me about Jesus on earth is that he told Philip this:

[ QUOTE ]
he that hath seen me hath seen the Father... I am in the Father, and the Father in me.. the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.


[/ QUOTE ]

Now, when John is raptured he sees the Father on the Throne, and if we take a close look we can see that Jesus is directly reflected in the father!

[ QUOTE ]
Revelation 4:1 "After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, "Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this. Immediately I was in the Spirit; and behold, a throne set in heaven, and One sat on the throne. And He who sat there was like a jasper and a sardius stone in appearance; and there was a rainbow around the throne, in appearance like an emerald.


[/ QUOTE ]

John says that God's appearance was like the crystal sparkling luminescence of a "jasper" stone combined with the blood red of a "sardine stone" (a stone named after the area in which it is found around Sardis). There is wonderful significance to these particular stones and their colors that emanate from the Father's throne.

Check this out! There were twelve stones sown on the High Priest's vest in the Old Testament, one for each of the twelve tribes of Israel. The "jasper" and "sardine" stones were the first and last stones on the vest.

<font color="red"> The jasper stone </font> represented the tribe of Ruben whose name meant "behold a son".

<font color="green"> The sardine stone </font> was for the tribe of Benjamin whose name meant "son of my right hand".

The fact that the Father's throne here is reflecting the colors of these two stones indicates His great love for and unit with the Son. This throne also belongs to Jesus who had been continuously seated there at his right hand since he ascended back to Heaven. Also we need to understand that both the Father and the Son reflect one another. They are one, as Old School said! The Lord Jesus perfectly reflected his Father when he was here on earth. In John 1:18, we read

[ QUOTE ]
"No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him."


[/ QUOTE ]

In this heavenly scene, the reverse is true. He that has seen the Father also has seen the Son! This is probably another reason why the Father, who is one in essence with his Son, is emanating the colors that are associated with him. I believe that this speaks of the fact that in divine essence the Father and the Son are truly one.

Pretty insane info! As is said in Isaih:

[ QUOTE ]
he may do his work, his strange work; and bring to pass his act, his strange act.


[/ QUOTE ]

The Lord truly is doing a marvelous and strange work! And the rapture is a taste of how awesome it truly is!

[Venom]

[ QUOTE ]
The jasper stone represented the tribe of Ruben whose name meant "behold a son".

The sardine stone was for the tribe of Benjamin whose name meant "son of my right hand". <hr /></blockquote>

Incredible information! As always, I am amazed at Gods marvelously strange and perfect work! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Adam Knowlden]

That's sweet info Jacob!

I never thought of it like that before! Very kool!

The First and the Last stones! Does that have any coorelation to Jesus saying, "I am the first and the last, the Beginning and the End"? Isn't it kool the way the whole bible weaves together! All the prophecies and analogies all tie in! Its defenietly the word of the Lord!

God's ways are strange, but that is because we can't comprehend God's wisdom in our limited minds! But one day I believe we will when we recieve our eternal bodies!

Just to stand in the Glory of God will be overwhelming!
I've caught glimpses of it before, but to be in his total presence has to be beyond any words we can use to describe it!

[President Wilson]

<blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: OldSchool:</font><hr> That's sweet info Jacob!

The First and the Last stones! Does that have any coorelation to Jesus saying, "I am the first and the last, the Beginning and the End"?

<hr /></blockquote>

It definately is correlated! That is amazing!

[ QUOTE ]
Isn't it kool the way the whole bible weaves together!
All the prophecies and analogies all tie in! Its defenietly the word of the Lord!
<hr /></blockquote>

That is why I am amazed at God's word!

[ QUOTE ]
Just to stand in the Glory of God will be overwhelming!
I've caught glimpses of it before, but to be in his total presence has to be beyond any words we can use to describe it! <hr /></blockquote>

Same here. When you are filled with the holy spirit hours can go by and only seem like minutes! I can only imagine after my experiences with God's spirit, what it will be like to be in his full presense! God has unimagionable wonders in store, that is for sure!

[gordmcfarling]

Do you believe the Rapture will happen soon?

[dbackdeb]

Old school, WOW!! I also believe this, and am looking forward to it. You do have a knack for writing and putting it like it is! Hope others read this, and possibly start in the right direction. In Christ, Deb

[Adam Knowlden]

Numerous other New Testament passages speak about Christs return. For instance, Titus 2:13: "Looking for that blessed hope [the Rapture], and the glorious appearing [the Revelation] of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ." Hebrews 10:25 speaks about that great "approaching" day. James mentions the hoarding of gold and silver in the last days: "Ye have heaped treasure [gold and silver] together for the last days" (5:3) and adds in verse 8, "the coming of the Lord draweth nigh." Likewise, Jude declares that, as the Lord returns with His saints, filthy dreamers or false prophets who have denied the Bible will be destroyed (see vv. 11-12;15).

There are also signs in the New Testament that speak of the relationship between Jerusalem and the Gentiles. One group of signs deals specifically with Jerusalems role in world history as well as the role of the Gentiles. Luke 21:24 declares, "Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled." In modern English, Christ stated, "Jerusalem will be controlled by Gentile nations and powers until the time of My return." Timothys grandmother, Lois, in 2 Timothy 1:5 may have mentioned this fantastic prophetical utterance to her grandson, but it did not occur in his lifetime. Generations of Jewish grandmothers probably referred to this sign, but it never occurred in their day. Enter the mockers of Scripture who throw their abusive insults: Where is the promise of this coming? Since our grandparents departure, all things continue as they were. However, remember .God "cannot lie" (Titus 1:2).

Finally, after nineteen hundred years of waitingafter seventy-five to one hundred generations of grandparents had lived and died, it finally happened. A six-day war was fought from June 5 to 10 in 1967. During the battle, the Jews took Jerusalem-one of the most powerful signs of Christ's return.(see setting the stage part I)

What about the six-day theory? Second Peter 3:8-9 contains a tremendous mathematical formula: "Beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." For years, I have referred to this passage as a mathematical masterpiece. Let us review it together. The promise God keeps is found in 2 Peter 3:4. It is the promise of His coming. Because God "cannot lie" (Titus 1:2), He will come again! His heart of love toward sinners is filled with patience, but soon the day of grace will end. His patience cannot go on eternally. His prearranged timetable must be fulfilled. What is this time frame? Can we mortals know such secrets? Yes, we can! Jesus said, "When ye shall see all these things, know that it is near even at the doors" (Matthew 24:33). Though we will never know the precise day or hour (Matthew 24:36), we can know Gods approximate schedule. How can this be? We read that a thousand years is as a day, and a day is as a thousand years. This is not as mysterious as it sounds. In fact, a few mental calisthenics give us the solution to this often-misunderstood equation.

God created the world in six days (Genesis 1:31) and rested on the seventh day (Genesis 2:2). Since a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as a day, we have six days of labor, signifying six thousand years of burdensome toil for humanity, and a final seventh day of rest-the millennial reign of Christ-when they live and reign with Christ a thousand years (Revelation 20:4). The calendar on your wall or in your wallet or purse demonstrates that this timetable is practically fulfilled.

Chronologists such as Archbishop James Ussher have worked strenuously on historical timetables to produce the following information: From Adam's creation to Christ's birth, approximately 4,000 years passed. From Christs birth to our day, 1,998 years have transpired. This gives us a total of 5,998 years. We are on the threshold of the final day! The six-day theory is not my invention, but rather the theory of scores of church fathers in earlier centuries. With that in mind, I want you to consider the following from the amazing document titled the Epistle of Barnabas-missionary with the apostle Paul (see Acts chapters 13,15). He said in A.D. 110...nineteen centuries ago:

And God made in six days the works of his hands; and he finished them on the seventh day, and he rested the seventh day, and sanctified it. Consider, my children, what that signifies, he finished them in six days. The meaning of it is this; that in six thousand years the Lord God will bring all things to an end. For with him one day is a thousand years; as himself testifieth saying, Behold this day shall be as a thousand years. Therefore, children, in six thousand years, shall all things be accomplished. And what is that he saith, And he rested the seventh day, he meaneth this; that when his Son shall come, and abolish the season of the Wicked One, and judge the ungodly; and shall change the sun and the moon and the stars; then he shall gloriously rest in that seventh day. (vv. 3-6)

Other early Church writings confirm the "signs of a thousand years." Irenaeus, an early church father who lived 1,850 years ago, wrote, "For in so many days as this world was made, in so many thousand years shall it be concluded.. . and God brought to a conclusion upon the sixth day the works he made." The Jewish Talmud states, "The world is to stand 6,000 years, viz., 2,000 confusion and void, 2,000 with the law, and 2,000 the time of the Messiah." The chronological tables could be off by as much as five to twelve years. However, we know that the time of the end is near, even at the doors, though we are not privy to the day or the hour. One thing is certain: Only a few minutes remain before midnight. Closing time is upon us. The Age of Grace is about to end, and believers are soon to rule and reign with the Lord Jesus Christ.

"For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed..."(II Thess. 2:7-8)

This literally means: He that hindereth the revelation fo the Antichrist, will conintue to hinder until he(The Holy Spirit who now restrains) be removed. Then shall the Lawless One be manifested.)

Paul made it clear that the consummation of Satan's program and purpose on the earth had been held in restraint until God's appointed time, and only by the removal of the restrainer can Satan's man of the hour, "that Wicked," that,"...man of sin...Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God...shewing himself that he is God"(vs. 3-4) be revealed. The sinister figure is personified as the "Beast" or anti-christ in Revelation 13.

The chuch, is the "salt of the earth", and the "Light of the World" is a great restraining influence in this corrupt and lawless age.

The Holy Spirit is resident within the Church, the body of born-again Believers who are, indeed, "the temple of the Holy Ghost." So, when the church is translated, the restraint or hindering will cease, and "that wicked" will be revealed.

So, since the Holy Spirit lives inside of the Belivers, when we are raptured the light of the earth is gone!

[gordmcfarling]

Old School,

Thanks for the clarification. Your writing has really been helpful. I am really enjoying this keep up the great work.

[Adam Knowlden]

No prob bro!

I'm glad it helped!

And I plan on doing stuff like this once per week!

I usually take whatever we talked about in Church and write about it as a study guide. Then I decided to start posting them here for you guys to check out!

I asked God to help expand my learning, and you guys have all defenietly done that with your additons to the posts!

So to me its all worth it!

As far as the prophecy posts, there are 3 left!

[gordmcfarling]

We studied Gideon this past week, he's interesting, the least of the least so to speak. A study on how God uses who he wants when he wants to put his message across. Very captivating. Kind of hand in hand with your posts.

[Venom]

"A study on how God uses who he wants when he wants to put his message across."

Great point, here is a good example of what you are saying.

1 Samuel 16: 1 - 23
1 And the LORD said unto Samuel, How long wilt thou mourn for Saul, seeing I have rejected him from reigning over Israel? fill thine horn with oil, and go, I will send thee to Jesse the Bethlehemite: for I have provided me a king among his sons. 2 And Samuel said, How can I go? if Saul hear it, he will kill me. And the LORD said, Take an heifer with thee, and say, I am come to sacrifice to the LORD. 3 And call Jesse to the sacrifice, and I will shew thee what thou shalt do: and thou shalt anoint unto me him whom I name unto thee. 4 And Samuel did that which the LORD spake, and came to Bethlehem. And the elders of the town trembled at his coming, and said, Comest thou peaceably? 5 And he said, Peaceably: I am come to sacrifice unto the LORD: sanctify yourselves, and come with me to the sacrifice. And he sanctified Jesse and his sons, and called them to the sacrifice.
6 And it came to pass, when they were come, that he looked on Eliab, and said, Surely the LORD'S anointed is before him. 7 But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart. 8 Then Jesse called Abinadab, and made him pass before Samuel. And he said, Neither hath the LORD chosen this. 9 Then Jesse made Shammah to pass by. And he said, Neither hath the LORD chosen this. 10 Again, Jesse made seven of his sons to pass before Samuel. And Samuel said unto Jesse, The LORD hath not chosen these. 11 And Samuel said unto Jesse, Are here all thy children? And he said, There remaineth yet the youngest, and, behold, he keepeth the sheep. And Samuel said unto Jesse, Send and fetch him: for we will not sit down till he come hither. 12 And he sent, and brought him in. Now he was ruddy, and withal of a beautiful countenance, and goodly to look to. And the LORD said, Arise, anoint him: for this is he. 13 Then Samuel took the horn of oil, and anointed him in the midst of his brethren: and the Spirit of the LORD came upon David from that day forward. So Samuel rose up, and went to Ramah.

Cool ha! God looks at the heart, not your out ward appearance or stature. And again, God took Moses staff, which pharaoh gave him to rule over scorpions, and made him a ruler over kings! And you will notice this same pattern throughout the bible.

But as you study these great men of God, you will notice one common thread, they had great faith! And without it, you cannot and will not please God. Paul speaks indepth on these soldiers of the Lord, who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions, quenched the violence of fire, escaped the edge of the sword, out of weakness were made strong, waxed valiant in fight, and turned to flight the armies of the aliens.

And so, the trend continues. /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[President Wilson]

<blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: gordmcfarling:</font><hr> We studied Gideon this past week, he's interesting, the least of the least so to speak. A study on how God uses who he wants when he wants to put his message across. Very captivating. Kind of hand in hand with your posts. <hr /></blockquote>

Definately one of the people I admire most in the bible! A true warrior, a great man of faith, and also very practical indeed.

[gordmcfarling]

I thought the best part of the whole Gideon story was the way God made Gideon send home a bunch of soldiers and only keep 300 to take on an army of 135,000. That is faith.

[Adam Knowlden]

Faith is awesome!

One of my favorites is in Joshua 3: 8,9,13.

That's the story when the Lord tells Joshua, "You shall command the priests who bear the ark of the covenant, when you come to the brink of the waters of the Jordan, you shall stand still in the Jordan".

Joshua said to the people of Israel,"When the soles of your feet of the priests who bear the ark of the Lord, the Lord of all the earth, shall rest in the waters of the Jordan, the waters of the Jordan shall be stopped from flowing, and the waters coming down from above shall stand in one heap."

The priests actually had to to dip their feet in the brink of the water. That was their act of faith. It involved risk. The risk of getting all wet and looking stupid before the people should God fail to keep his side of the promise!

But when they took this step of faith, God stopped up the waters!

I love little stories of faith like that! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[President Wilson]

That is awesome! The archaeological excavation of Jerricho was also incredible! Really cool stuff. But yes, faith is what it is all about. What amazes me in my life, is that everytime I have had faith in God, he has met me. Each and everytime.

[KrYptic.x]

<blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: JWilson:</font><hr> What amazes me in my life, is that everytime I have had faith in God, he has met me. Each and everytime. <hr /></blockquote>

I honestly must admit to this too JW.

So many times when Matthew 7:7 has been sooo true in my own life.

...Never doubt my friends...never doubt

[President Wilson]

<blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: KrYptic:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: JWilson:</font><hr> What amazes me in my life, is that everytime I have had faith in God, he has met me. Each and everytime. <hr /></blockquote>

I honestly must admit to this too JW.

So many times when Matthew 7:7 has been sooo true in my own life.

...Never doubt my friends...never doubt <hr /></blockquote>

Right on Kryptic, and that is an oustanding scripture, thanks for sharing!

[Adam Knowlden]

Defenietly kool brotha! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[oes]

<blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: TrustNoOne:</font><hr> <blockquote><font class="small">Posted by: Archetype:</font><hr> I am currently reading book two of the nine part series "Left Behind". It is about the Rapture of the church. While I am not sure how much of it is actually biblical, but they are amazing books. I haven't actually read your post yet, but after posting this I am going to. I really want to compare what you post to what the books are about. I would highly recommend them. <hr /></blockquote> I just bought the first book of the Left Behind series this Saturday and I was going to post in Athletes Shooting The Breeze to ask if anyone here has read it. I guess you beat me to it Archetype /forum/images/graemlins/tongue.gif.I just started it, so am curious to reviews of those who read it. It seems to me to be a cross between Stephen Kings The Langoliers [ the airplane part in the beginning] and The Stand from what little I have read on review sites about. So who else here has read it? [Sorry Oldschool, didn't mean to hijack your thread /forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif ] <hr /></blockquote>

I have read all 10 books, they are riviting man. I hope they put out another one.

Awesome post Adam, I agree with everything you said with one exception, and that is the "baptizm of the Holy Spirit". I believe that when you ask Jesus into your heart, confess your sins, repent of your sins and recieve Him into your heart that you are then baptized in the Holy Spirit. But I noticed that you are going to get into that later so I'll leave it at that. Praise God for your desire to post your learnings of His Holy Word. Thanks and keep it up. /forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Adam Knowlden]

Well, when you get saved you have the Holy Spirit in you.

But baptism in the Holy Ghost is the next level.

You have to be ready to sacrifice your self for Christ, and dedicate your life to him. And really mean in your heart that you will do whatever the Lord asks. All you have to do is ask for it and you will recieve it.

I will get more into it later to help clarify. I'll try to get the post up tonight if I get a chance!

[Adam Knowlden]

Baptism by Fire!

If you have received Jesus as your Savior God is living in you!
By the Holy Spirit he has joined himself to your Spirit!
Your Spirit is now alive, whereas before it was dead.

"If anyone be in Christ, he is a new creature"II Cor. 5:17

We are also guaranteed to spend eternity with Christ!
That within itself is awesome! Its true hope!

At first you may have experienced the anointing of God when you got saved. That deep sense of love and peace that let you knew God was alive in you.

After awhile the feeling left, and God felt more distant. Why is that?
Well we need to understand that we are made up of three parts.
The soul (your psychological part your intellect, will, and emotions) and your body, your physical part. And lastly the most important part your eternal Spirit!

Your body and soul however, were accustomed to running the show so to speak. And it usually isn't long before they pretty much overwhelmed your new life in the spirit, and resumed the driver's seat. You are so accustomed to living by your thoughts, feelings, and desired-fueled by your soul, and by the demands of your body, that you soon lose track of that voice of the newly living Spirit in you. It would seem that something needs to happen to your soul and body before your spirit can gain stronger control again.

This "something" that needs to happen is that the Holy Spirit Who is living inside you needs to flow out to fill your soul and body. This is described in the Scriptures in a variety of ways. Just as the experience of accepting Jesus is spoken throughout the Bible in different ways, so a number of descriptions are given of the next experience:

Baptism in the Holy Spirit!
Or "receiving the Holy Spirit", "Pentecost","receiving power",the Holy Spirit to "come upon"or "fall upon" a person. All these are expressions of baptism by the Holy Spirit!

Read the following scriptures again:

John 1:33, Acts 1:5, Matt. 3:11, Mark 1:8, Luke 3:16, Acts 11:16,

And you will see that in each case it is not salvation that is spoken of but a second experience!

"He that believeth on me...out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water." John 7:38

When we receive Jesus as our savior the Holy Spirit comes in, but as we continue to trust and believe in Jesus, the Indwelling Spirit can our out to inundate, or baptize, our soul and body, and refresh the world around us!

I know the term, "receiving the Holy Spirit",may sound weird. You may ask, "How can I receive the Holy Spirit when I already have him living in me?" This expression can be understood if we remember that we are talking about a person, not a thing or a quantity of something. The Holy Spirit is a person, so he is either living in you or He isn't. You have to allow him to be a total part of your life. Allow him to guide you and have faith in God. You have to be willing to sacrifice for Christ, and take up your cross. You have to make a commitment to God to be his servant and do his will.

The testimony of the Holy Spirit:

Perhaps the most powerful testimony of the Holy Spirit can be found in the Savior himself...Jesus.

God's only son, the Creative Word, Who was from all eternity with the Father, and by whom the worlds were created, took upon Himself a human Soul and Body. When he did this he set aside all his power, and accepted the limitations of natural humanity. (Phil. 2:7-8)

His human body was truly human, with all the limitations of a human body. His psychological being although perfect was subject to limitations as well.

He subjected himself to growth and development of a human child. As a child no one even knew he was God in the flesh. Even his mother Mary, had only an inkling. When he started his ministry his mother was amazed and worried. His own brothers and sisters didn't believe in him. The people of the village where he was brought up said, "Who does he think he is? We know him: He's the carpenter's son!" They were so angry they tried to kill him. (Matt. 13:54-58, Luke 4:16-30)

What was it that happened to Jesus, who grew up a poor carpenter, to the time when he suddenly went out to preach, "The kingdom of God is at hand!"

The answer is the Holy Spirit! He was born in the Spirit (conceived by the Holy Ghost) but when he began to minister the Holy Spirit came on him in a new way.

As we read in the Bible, The Holy Spirit descended on him when John the Baptist baptized him in the River Jordan! And Jesus went into the wilderness, "full of the Holy Ghost!"

However, the Holy Spirit was already living in him from the beginning, long before John baptized him and the Spirit came on him like a dove. The Spirit began to manifest itself on Jesus in a new way, filling him with power. The Spirit drove him into the wilderness to be tempted by the Devil, and after his victory there Jesus returned in the power of the Spirit into Galilee. (Luke 4:14)

Why was the manifestation of the Spirit held back until then? One was so that Jesus could live a normal everyday life without being detected. The Father kept the son concealed. It seems likely that the Devil himself was deceived by this. It was not until Jesus received the full power of the Spirit that Satan confronted him. We see attempts made to destroy Jesus, like Herod's order (under the influence of the devil) to kill all new born babies in the city Jesus was born in. But it seems more likely that Satan himself was not fully aware of Jesus until he was baptized in the Spirit.

But perhaps the main reason for the delay was in order that Jesus could show us by example what was supposed to happen to us. The baptizer in the Holy Spirit was Himself baptized in the Holy Spirit as an example for us!

What are the benefits of being baptized in the Spirit?

Man, I could write volumes on this!

First and foremost, you become more painfully aware of yourself, or the things that offend or hinder His growth in you. This is really a blessing! We better learn to control our human side, and as a result our lives begin to produce an abundance of spiritual fruit!

The enemy is much more real, and the enemy is much more aware of you!

God's word comes much more alive! The Holy Spirit will allow you to see how to apply the scriptures to your actual life! That is really awesome! I could write books on this!

Faith in God is quadrupled.

Direct communication with Jesus. The link becomes much stronger, especially through tongues. Which everyone can do if they've been baptized by the Spirit. It's just a way to praise God beyond our finite human minds! Its not some weird trance or vision, it's your spirit talking to God and requires total faith in God.

God's gifts flow out of you so much it is uncontrollable!

This is just the beginning! /forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[President Wilson]

That was truly amazing Old School! Thankyou for sharing!

[ QUOTE ]
Direct communication with Jesus. The link becomes much stronger, especially through tongues. Which everyone can do if they've been baptized by the Spirit. It's just a way to praise God beyond our finite human minds! Its not some weird trance or vision, it's your spirit talking to God and requires total faith in God.

God's gifts flow out of you so much it is uncontrollable!

This is just the beginning!

<hr /></blockquote>

That is very true. When we walk after the spirit our connection with Jesus becomes stronger, and stronger until we can literally see his face.

[ QUOTE ]
It's just a way to praise God beyond our finite human minds! <hr /></blockquote>

Again, very true. When one is filled with the Holy Spirit, hours can pass and seem like seconds. It is a time that is essentially undescribable, and more powerful than anything a person can experience. It is beyond comprehension. The only way I can describe it, is to be filled with every ounce of love you have ever experienced in one fail swoop, and even that pails in comparision to what it is to have the Holy Spirit living within you.

It is truly amazing! Thanks again Old School!

[oes]

Awesome post bro, but I can see that you and I see things a little diffrently due to the fact that I believe as a Baptist, and you must be Non-Denominational. And thats ok. We could pick this bone forever, but the fact remains that we have recieived Christ as our personal Savior and are indeed brothers in Christ.

However, I would like to post what I believe to be true. But I will have to do this later because it is 2:27 a.m.

God Bless, and keep up the great work!!

[gordmcfarling]

oes,

You contradict yourself by saying what you said. [ QUOTE ]


Awesome post bro, but I can see that you and I see things a little diffrently due to the fact that I believe as a Baptist, and you must be Non-Denominational. And thats ok. We could pick this bone forever, but the fact remains that we have recieived Christ as our personal Savior and are indeed brothers in Christ.
<hr /></blockquote>
If you believe, you believe as a Christian. Not a Baptist, God isn't a Baptist, He's God. The way you wrote about denomination is that Baptist is the top and everything else in Non-Denominational. There are other denominations. It makes me chuckle when I read this because it's like we are wrong but you are right because you are Baptist. I mean no offense by this post but, it seems high and mighty for a man to suggest his denomination is better then any other. Take the time to read John 17:20-26. Jesus prays for all believers. We are all equal in God's eyes once we recieve Christ into our heart. Being a Baptist or Pentacostal is irrelevant to Him. Can you please clarify this?

[Venom]

No, Oes doesn't feel like he is better than anyone.

All he said is that he is in a different segment of Christianity; therefore they have different opinions on some matters. That's it, not that he is better than anyone. Oes has been on here forever and is one of the most humbled Godly men I have ever seen. He is definitely not separating himself and saying "I am holier than though" or something.

As he stated earlier in his post, "but we both are brothers in Christ and that's what matters. " Just having a conversation, that's all. Nothing to read into.

[Adam Knowlden]

I agree, and I don't want this post to turn into a religious debate.

But to let those who don't know Christ to realize that Jesus died for you so that you can be a part of the Rapture, and be delivered from the wrath to come!

And as a study guide to fellow Christians.

The next post will be about the Tribulation!